Feynman was not a mathematician.
Does True Randomness Actually Exist? ( ^&*#^%$&#% )
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Feb 22, 2020
0
#883
The principles of science are based in observation. Making measurements, collecting data of verifiable, empirical evidence. The existence of infinite multi-verses can not be observed nor measured, it lies outside the realm of science. Elroch has his a priori beliefs, like everybody else, he simply gets side-tracked by the numbers.
You should see him get side-tracked in open discussion, I couldn't get out of there fast enough.
Feb 22, 2020
0
#885
MustangMate wrote:
The principles of science are based in observation. Making measurements, collecting data of verifiable, empirical evidence. The existence of infinite multi-verses can not be observed nor measured, it lies outside the realm of science. Elroch has his a priori beliefs, like everybody else, he simply gets side-tracked by the numbers.
No, I merely point out that the MWH is an economical (simple and elegant, a la Occam's razor) interpretation of QM that is entirely successful. Moreover, as time has gone by, physicists have become increasingly enthusiastic about this interpretation.
It is possible that it is a pointer to a deeper truth than the testable science, but that is something about which I would reserve judgement rather than believe.
I luvd that one Zebra ! and i get it. cuz they say that Guinea has the lowest ave IQ in the world. s/t like 59. so wonderful story !
MustangMate wrote:
I lean more towards madness. Easy to be gullible about such fantasy, ask Isaac Asimov, the greatest short strory writer on themes as the multi-verse. Entertain fantasy and perhaps allow a certain amount of gullibility, but to whole-heatedly believe that other worlds exist besides this one - is mad, sheer madness !
Anyway, not sure I follow the last part of your statement in this text..
but to whole-heartedly believe that other worlds exist besides this one - is mad, sheer madness !
funny thing King. at first ?....i thought mwh meant math whole-heartedly...lol !
lol yeah.. I was thinking that water in the presence of sunlight kinda rocks too.
I suspect certain people are going to like this commercial for the wrong reasons 
Feb 22, 2020
0
#892
Optimissed wrote:
Elroch wrote:
Optimissed wrote:
MustangMate wrote:
I lean more towards madness. Easy to be gullible about such fantasy, ask Isaac Asimov, the greatest short strory writer on themes as the multi-verse. Entertain fantasy and perhaps allow a certain amount of gullibility, but to whole-heatedly believe that other worlds exist besides this one - is mad, sheer madness !
Yes it is, when it is understood that they think an infinite number of universes exist, just so that randomness apparently needn't occur. It is insanity because it defies the fundamental principles of science.
You think so? Which specific principles? Please be explicit: this is necessary in science, as you would surely acknowledge.
I have a friend who has a friend who knows a man
Who likes to play the pipes of Pan
He told me. He has a kwolifikayshun.
Consider one nice piece of evidence for the validity of the MWH
Is that the Many Worlds Happening?
Near enough - Multiple Worlds Hypothesis (the idea that everything possible is happening all of the time).
- the Feynman interpretation of quantum mechanics. In this, you find that if you take (literally) every possible path that a particle could take, given the observations, and add together the complex numbers that are determined solely by the length of the path, then you get predictions which are consistent with that of all the other interpretations of quantum mechanics.
Yes, you would do. It's quite intuitively likely. Just more of it, though. After all, everything's the same shape however you measure it.
<<Indeed it is reasonable to consider the Schroedinger wave equation as a way of representing the time-dependent evolution of this sum of all possible paths.>>
Yes of course, but that doesn't mean it's real.
The classical notion of "reality" has disappeared from physics (unless you include the possibility of the reality of the infinite dimensional, continually infinitely branching multiverse).
This is because there never is a definite state which determines the future. Rather there are statistics which influence future statistics in a quantifiable way.
I know it is uncomfortable to give up the idea of definiteness, but it was not discarded lightly. The nearest to reality is any of the interpretations that correctly predict statistics, but not some preferred one of them.
It is not completely possible that this will change in the future, but I have not seen anyone suggest how it might.
Feb 23, 2020
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#893
Optimissed wrote:
Bar Mars then.
I suspect certain people were being ironic?
This one was, anyhow.
The classical notion of "reality" has disappeared from physics [making it no longer physics] (unless you include the possibility of the reality of the infinite dimensional, continually infinitely branching multiverse). [Russell's Teapot blither]
This is because there never is a definite state which determines the future. Rather there are statistics which influence future statistics in a quantifiable way. [oh, so now we're talking about statistics. Not interested in bouncing around the room w/ ur brainstorms. sorry.]
I know it is uncomfortable to give up the idea of definiteness [it only is for u cuz ur scared. alotta ppl welcome it], but it was not discarded lightly. The nearest to reality is any of the interpretations that correctly predict statistics, but not some preferred one of them. [blah blah blah]
It is not completely possible that this will change in the future, but I have not seen anyone suggest how it might. [.....and dont getchur hopes up]
kooky psychobabble. u needta stop plonking.
Optimissed wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QiNRObpq4tA
Audience .... Friend's Friend's Friend. Worth a listen if you were ever a freak.
I didn't know this group. I Had a Dream live in 2013 , also good https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVe6UJ3RKsM
opti: "In general, the problem encountered by Elroch and others is that metaphorical language is used to explain mathematical results and then people go and take the metaphors literally"
"So we get the ridiculous themes of there being literally many universes"
i dont think of many worlds as many physical universes. only one. but its abstract, kind of like consciousness or heat. in other words.. i think of it as an emergent from some sort of a none local "device" that include all the possibilities.
obviously it sound insane, and i dislike it. but logically its just as good as any other interpretation.
theres another idea that i do like, but it has nothing to do with many words.
the multiverse.. how do you even imagine a single universe? like a dust ball floating in nothingness? it just doesnt make any sense to me : )
Feb 23, 2020
0
#898
Probably every concept we think of as "solid" and "real" is an emergent phenomenon, a sort of high level pattern that is very different to the underlying truth.
This applies even to time and space. It is now believed that the structure we see in our Universe can be emergent from the entanglement of states in a Hilbert space. This extends to our Universe being one branch of a Multiverse without the underlying "simple" Hilbert space structure being any more complicated than for a single Universe. "Spooky action at a distance" is the phenomenon that most strongly hints at this, with only part of the phenomenon fitting conveniently into our usual notion of events being related in a causal manner. While there is no breach of causality, you do need information outside of space-time (the impossibility of a local hidden variables explanation is proven result, by the breach of Bell's inequality).
Randomness doesn't actually average out. If you toss a coin a huge number of times, the proportion of heads will converge to a proportion (ideally 1/2) but it will not be precise at any finite number of tosses.
thats ur answer ??....just cuz ur theory doesnt work in reality isnt my problem, its urs.
OHH !....but u can always fallback on the spineless "....but w/ an infinite amount of tries it will" How in the he!! would u know that it will work w/ an infinite amount of tries ?
ykw ?....go get an Rx for some reality pills. u can probably get them at ur local psyche ward.
Ain't Math Grand !
or
the AMG