Why, it's worked everywhere it's been tried.

Well, socialism hasn't really worked. Take a good look at the USSR and see how well it worked out. :) You can't make everybody march at the same pace. If anything, the ideas of wealth redistribution will make everybody poorer and lazier and, while intentions behind these ideas may be good, the practical results will end up being bad. There was a Russian PM who famously said "We wanted to do it better, but it turned out as always." :)

In a somewhat related news, check out this article about "Communist" China on Marketwatch:

"Move over, New York. Beijing is now where the most billionaires roam"

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/move-over-new-york-beijing-is-now-where-the-most-billionaires-roam-2016-02-25?dist=lbeforebell

China gradually ditched communist economic system. Despite all the inequality and flaws of capitalism, their standard of living is going up and rapidly so. Back in the 80s, they were the larger version of today's North Korea. Had they stayed that way, they'd probably be as mean as, and much more dangerous than, North Korea. But now that their standard of living has gone up, and they have a stake at the table, they are working with the rest of the World for a better future for all.

So, it seems a little bizarre to me that many intellectuals in the West wanna travel down the well-traveled but failed path. But, I guess it's not too surprising since many of them were heavily influenced by communist ideas. I'll hand over the microphone to Yuri Bezmenov from here. Check him out on YouTube:

Former KGB Agent Yuri Bezmenov Explains How to Brainwash a Nation (Full Length)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5It1zarINv0

Cencored, you've raised a fair point about technological change. However, with technological change people still need to do the work. There's always plenty of work. We're just transitioning from one era to another all the time. I'll admit that it's hard for an older worker than it is for a younger one. I've personally had to go through such a transition when I was younger. I'm still not old and I can still do it if necessary. However, as workers and as individuals, we also have the responsibility to not let ourselves slip into poverty. Saying that because of technological changes skills become obsolete so we'll just need to keep paying the people is nonsense. That way we'll encourage more laziness on their part. I've collected unemployment and I know how lazy it made me. Cushy life, yay! Was nice while it lasted but I wouldn't wanna live like that. Bein' a parasite is no living. It should be an individual responsibility to save for a rainy day. And if one is doing a min. wage job all his/her life, he/she should think twice before starting a family. Nobody said life is easy. We still need to adapt and survive, albeit in a different World. At any rate, our standard of living is going up, thanks to technology. But, we're getting repetitive here. We can agree to disagree but I hope you and others who think like you have at least had the chance to understand a different perspective. Perhaps you can try to expose yourselves to a multitude of information and be more flexible in thinking to be more unbiased about the reality. A reality we may not like but it's there and we live in it. I'll leave it there. :)

Censored, I'm not a materialistic person myself. However, I understand that we all have individual rights & responsibilities. And responsibilities are first of all towards ourselves. When we live in a society, we need to build our nest eggs; we need to have the reserves for ourselves and not rely on others to provide. After that's accomplished, we're free to pursue other interests. Unless, of course, we can pursue other interests such as music or chess and do it so well that we're rewarded for it handsomely. I can say, oh, I just wanna play chess, why should I work? But I'd be homeless if I did that and rightfully so. And I'm not even somebody who has a ton of savings. As I mentioned before, I'm making the ends meet just like most people. However, I still understand that it's up to me to pull it off, and not to rely on others to provide for me. That's actually a shameful way of thinking, if you think about it. It's a beggar's attitude. Everything's wrong with that! :) I also recognize that I've made some mistakes in life; but I embrace them and realize that they were also my fault. Sure, life wasn't always fair to me as it's not to so many. But could've I done better? Yes! Did I do my best? No! So, I'm not whining and crying about what could've been. Just rough it out and keep working hard and not complaining about it. I know some rich folks and, I know they've worked hard. They've never had the luxury to sit hours in a coffee shop to play chess. They don't care about it, they don't see the beauty & the value of it. They're shallow in that way but they don't care. And I don't care about them or their money. They had their life path, I have mine, you have yours. I say, don't whine about it and ask or demand more. We all are rich in our unique ways. :) That'll be it from me on this thread. I hope I presented my views clearly enough and I don't see the point of going on and repeating myself too much. Thanks everybody for the discussion.

Well this has gotten deep and nowhere fast, I just skipped the last chapters... I mean, posts. ;)

Ok, so Censored is for a welfare state and everybody else isn't. Ok, so we can see from the past that welfare states are terrible do-nothing's, unless you have a dictator (Stalin). We can see in China that capitalism is a great thing that produces results. I think Censored's argument about how we can do it and thus we should because of technology and things are faulty. Technology doesn't make labor obsolete, it just makes it change forms. Also, why should *I* ever be forced to give up *my hard-earned money* to a lazy bum just so they can not be in poverty? If they want out of poverty, they can get off their lazy bum and find a job and become a man and *work*! :) Wealth distribution is a terrible idea, it literally kills all incentive to work and get ahead. If the poor want money, let them have the opportunity to work for it, don't just give it to them. :)

United Arab Emirates is the country with the largest proportion of immigrant worksers :)

Obviouslt, the real test is immigrants/native population and not total size.

If USA and Andorra took for instance 100.000 migrants, the andorrans would reduce themselves to a minority in their own country.

Because then you loose your jobs and you are out in the street.

But agree completely the technology change is SO fast now, and making political ideologies almost redundant and anachronistic.

You can spend 10 years debating some issue and finally make a decision - and then PLONK some gizmo is invented that makes the whole debate pointless.

Robotization is a BIG BIG challenge for all economies.

Hundreds of millions of jobs migt vanish in thin air in the not so distand futture.

In my own city the first 100% automated bar opened last week. I presume in 20 years, there are no bartender jobs anymore.

Supermarkets are also introducing machines so you scan the goodies themselves, and for sure people are working on robots to repace the Wallmart cashiers.

Driverless cars are on the way as well, in Holland they plan to introdice a driverless bus in some years.

So we are looking at the jobs of 

- bartenders, fastfood, some restaurants

- all driving jobs (bus drivers, taxi drivers, long distance drivers)

- many jobs in retail

... are just gonna vanish in think air.

And that's just the sectors I can think of right now. I'm sure robots are in their way in many other places also. (Cleaning, hotels, maybe some jobs in construction, farming.)

That's a LOT of people out of a job, and not se easy to say where the bus driver guys will find another job.

Cheap 3-D printers will also wreak havoc on the economy for instance, if they come.

Correct, but it has worked anyway because people are out of a job once in a while, so the available jobs get shared more or less.

If you need only 80% of the workforce, it just means that people on average spend 20% of their work years unemployed and work the rest. 

How can you say that ?....you're well-cared for, fed twice daily, you get to lick your owner's face, they take walks & selfie's w/ you, you're combed, you're baby-talked to, & on & on & on.

The USA/T's cannot feed you pablum from your favorite . You must lift yourself from poverty.

That's why I think that poverty in the USA/T's is long-term voluntary and short temporary.

But don't wait until you need hair dye at the drugstore. 'Cuz 40% of all Baby Boomers are totally broke at age 65. It's pathetic and self-inflicted.

Strange thing to get sick and tired of.  Who gives a damn' if the dregs of society are afforded a meagre lifestyle paid for by the greater society?  The slice of the pie they are given, for nothing, is miniscule. 

My tax money that goes to billionaires sickens me much more that that coupla' pennies that goes to buying some bum a 40.

There seems to be a lot of people who agree with you:

Why are Americans so angry?

I'm not angry, I was just making a point.  Life is a wonderful thing and I smile a lot.

I meant more in ref to this statement:

"seems to only be working for the insiders with money and power, like those on Wall Street or in Washington,"

Of course the people are angry, you have 25%, 30%, 40% taxes on working people, bums get free money and the rich people are not doing anything to help, because you know, taking 90% of a rich guys money is the solution here guys, come on, (sarcasm) and then you have ideas like, let's have an extra 15% tax on everybody so everybody can be lazy... I mean, equal. ;) Lots of sarcasm in there but it's true, the people are angry and it should be no surprise why. :)

Not lazy,just to have the minimum needed to survive. The tax won't cost anyone until their salary goes above $100,000 a year,and they get $5,000 a year at that level. It's not going to hurt what's left of the middle class:it will help them.What's wrong with that?

Like I mentioned elsewhere with slavery. Human trafficking is capitalism at it's finest.

Bill Gates estimated net worth in 2015 was $79.2 billion!!!

And you are concerned about people who require a few thousand per year to survive with basic needs?  

And there are 536 billionaires in the USA. 

Robot surgeons are putting human ones out of business.