Is there any Asian could become world champion?

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Avatar of uplaner

I think Magnus will dominate the chess world for some time. He will be well prepared for the match.

Avatar of fabelhaft

"Bu has perfect age, ca. the same as Aronian"

But soon turning 32 and never having been top 20 I doubt that his prospect are too promising as future World Championship contender. He won a nice game against Carlsen, but I would be very surprised if he beat Svidler, and even more surprised if he beat MVL/Grischuk.

Avatar of kimberly47

Calling Bu a serious contender because he managed to win a game against Carlsen a little silly. 

Avatar of DjonniDerevnja
elburke wrote:

Calling Bu a serious contender because he managed to win a game against Carlsen a little silly. 

Have you played trough his winning game? That was very good chess , including a bold sacrifice.

Avatar of kimberly47
DjonniDerevnja wrote:
elburke wrote:

Calling Bu a serious contender because he managed to win a game against Carlsen a little silly. 

Have you played trough his winning game? That was very good chess , including a bold sacrifice.

 

Yes, it was basically the same set of ideas ideas from the Marshall Attack of the Ruy Lopez (the pawn sac with 8...d4), but he said he had NEVER played that line before! I have won with the Marshall twice against players 400 points higher than me...it is a line and set of ideas worth knowing, and I have never seen a game like Bu played with these same ideas in a different line. Brilliant.

But no, one great game does not make him a serious contender for World Champion, not by any stretch of the imagination. There is a reason why no professional chess commentator has even mentioned this preposterous idea, let alone argue it.

Avatar of yureesystem

GM So will be the next world champion, he has dynamic style something Carlsen hates and will lose to in a short match.

Avatar of yureesystem

Carlsen passive play and opening pick ( Bishop opening) is the reason why he lost; Magnus think he can play anything and win, Wrong! Lets compare a real chess genius Capablanca who had to defend a vicious attack and Marshall prepare his line for ten years and Capablanca accepted the challenge and defended brilliantly and won.

Avatar of DjonniDerevnja
mickynj wrote:

Bu won a good game because he is a very good player. But guess what? All his games aren't as good as that. There is a reason that he has not spent the last few years in the top ten. 

This is not to take anything away from Bu, he is a very fine player, but let's not go overboard!

Progress doesnt come linear. Bu had a wild progress as a child, but not the last decade. Maybe this year is his leaping year?  I think all those 2600+ players are fantastic and I am not able (not good enough) to tell who is the best .  Magnus looks the strongest, but the other ones also plays fantastic chess. 

Avatar of kimberly47

Yes, Bu beat him once Bu is going to be the next world champion...right.

Avatar of DjonniDerevnja
elburke wrote:

Yes, Bu beat him once Bu is going to be the next world champion...right.

Not many players have ever beaten Magnus once. I dont guess Bu as the first new world Champion after Magnus, my guess is Praggananda, maybe in 2026. But I think BU can give us a fantastic match. First he must come top two in the World Cup, and then he must win the Candidates. Not an easy task, but he is one  of my ten top favorites to qualify.  Who wins the Candidates is So difficult to predict . They are so good, and so even.  Small psychological or physical factors can decide one decisive game. If a player has a huge victory one day, he can be so high on the victory that he falls a sleep to late and dont have the power to win the next day.  The players in the candidates has maybe only 60 points rating difference. Thats close to nothing.  The players below 2770 might be underrated because they play less superinvitationals and a lot open tournaments. In an open tournament you can play perfect and drop rating. GM Jon Ludvig Hammer was close to perfect in Extracon Chess Open, undefeated, with 5 victories, and  with two more draws than GM Baadur Jobava. He only won one rating point ( Jon Ludvig got 7,5 and Baadur 8,5 in 10 rounds).

Avatar of fabelhaft

"I think BU can give us a fantastic match"

I think Bu will never play a title match for the World Championship :-)

"The players below 2770 might be underrated because they play less superinvitationals and a lot open tournaments. In an open tournament you can play perfect and drop rating. GM Jon Ludvig Hammer was close to perfect in Extracon Chess Open, undefeated, with 5 victories, and  with two more draws than GM Baadur Jobava. He only won one rating point"

Since he only won against opponents rated in the 1900s-2400s (one in the 1900s, one in the 2100s, two in the 2300s...) and drew against his strongest opponents, rated in the 2400s-2500s.  

Avatar of kimberly47
DjonniDerevnja wrote:
elburke wrote:

Yes, Bu beat him once Bu is going to be the next world champion...right.

Not many players have ever beaten Magnus once. I dont guess Bu as the first new world Champion after Magnus, my guess is Praggananda, maybe in 2026. 

 

How many? Can anyone find a list a players who have beaten Carlsen ONCE in classic time controls since he became world Champion? What would you call "not many"?

 

 

Avatar of kimberly47

At chessgames. com, I found 14 games that Carlsen has lost in 2017 alone. You are making too much about Bu. It is ridiculous. Here are the people who have beat him. Please explain what gives Bu a better chance than the others.

 

R Rappaport
D Andreikin
Aronian
Kramnik
Jobava
Grischuk
Vachier-Lagrave (3 times)
Nakamura
Karjakin
Giri
So
Bu

We should retitle this thread "People claim nonsense, and Elburke calls them on it with simple facts".

Avatar of DjonniDerevnja
fabelhaft wrote:

"I think BU can give us a fantastic match"

I think Bu will never play a title match for the World Championship :-)

"The players below 2770 might be underrated because they play less superinvitationals and a lot open tournaments. In an open tournament you can play perfect and drop rating. GM Jon Ludvig Hammer was close to perfect in Extracon Chess Open, undefeated, with 5 victories, and  with two more draws than GM Baadur Jobava. He only won one rating point"

Since he only won against opponents rated in the 1900s-2400s (one in the 1900s, one in the 2100s, two in the 2300s...) and drew against his strongest opponents, rated in the 2400s-2500s.  


It wasnt only Hammer that scored 7,5, lossless and only gained one point, They were 3 or 4 players with that result. Jobava was lucky. He could have lost against FM Johannes Haug, but maybe Johannes was in timetrouble or something . He accepted or offered a draw in a good position. Those open tournaments are rough. Those GMs risk walking straight into a homeprep from an IM-teenager.
Avatar of whiskersinthejamjar

Carlsen should lose his world champion crown after getting his cork popped by Bu.

Avatar of DjonniDerevnja
elburke wrote:

At chessgames. com, I found 14 games that Carlsen has lost in 2017 alone. You are making too much about Bu. It is ridiculous. Here are the people who have beat him. Please explain what gives Bu a better chance than the others.

 

R Rappaport
D Andreikin
Aronian
Kramnik
Jobava
Grischuk
Vachier-Lagrave (3 times)
Nakamura
Karjakin
Giri
So
Bu

We should retitle this thread "People claim nonsense, and Elburke calls them on it with simple facts".

I cant tell why or if Bu has better chances.  He is one of them that has chances. What I think is that who has the good day and week makes a lot difference. Remember Caruana in Sinquefield (2015?) Aronian had a couple great weeks lately . Norway Chess was an Aronian week MVL had this in Sinquefield. It all cooks down to who has his great weak in the candidates. Those players are all good enough when they have their week.

Avatar of kimberly47
whiskeyinthejamjar wrote:

Carlsen should lose his world champion crown after getting his cork popped by Bu.

 

Yes, the world title should be determined by a single game, ex post facto. 

Avatar of kimberly47
DjonniDerevnja wrote:
elburke wrote:

At chessgames. com, I found 14 games that Carlsen has lost in 2017 alone. You are making too much about Bu. It is ridiculous. Here are the people who have beat him. Please explain what gives Bu a better chance than the others.

 

R Rappaport
D Andreikin
Aronian
Kramnik
Jobava
Grischuk
Vachier-Lagrave (3 times)
Nakamura
Karjakin
Giri
So
Bu

We should retitle this thread "People claim nonsense, and Elburke calls them on it with simple facts".

I cant tell why or if Bu has better chances.  He is one of them that has chances. What I think is that who has the good day and week makes a lot difference. Remember Caruana in Sinquefield (2015?) Aronian had a couple great weeks lately . Norway Chess was an Aronian week MVL had this in Sinquefield. It all cooks down to who has his great weak in the candidates. Those players are all good enough when they have their week.

 

Were Caruana or Aronian ever 31-year old who had never ever even seen the top 20? Terrible example. 

Google "most outrageous and unbelievable upset in history", and that might not even be a good example of something comparative. 

Avatar of wayne_thomas
elburke wrote:

At chessgames. com, I found 14 games that Carlsen has lost in 2017 alone. You are making too much about Bu. It is ridiculous. Here are the people who have beat him. Please explain what gives Bu a better chance than the others.

 R Rappaport

Perhaps you are thinking of the offbeat Hungarian GM Richard Rapport.

Avatar of BeepBeepImA747
No Asian could be world champion it is impossible.