All i do is make a vote then 2 min. later 2 other ppl comment!!
A TALLY OF DATABASE-USERS & NON-USERS
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artfizz wrote:
MainStreet wrote:
As of 10/4/08:
Users - 82, Non-Users -100
The chess.com survey on the homepage is in broad agreement with this tally's numbers.
Do you use opening databases, books or other reference materials when playing turn-based correspondence chess (e-chess)? Yes. (33%) No. (44%) I didn't know that using that stuff was allowed.(13%) What's an opening database? (10%)
Thank you! 1408 votes cast.
It may be time to accept that just about all that can reasonably be said has been said. I intend to do ONE FINAL LIST - and then call it a day. My thanks to Mainstreet for initiating such an interesting and remarkably rational (on the whole) discussion - and for moderating it with diplomacy and equity.
We salute all the posters for their straightforward, candid comments.
And a special mention is in order for Artfizz who initiated the List of Posters. Thank you so much, Art!
The thread, however, shall remain open for those who are still interested in expressing the reasons of their preference.
Evil_Homer wrote:
MainStreet wrote:
mpetten wrote:
I use the opening explorer to help me to understand the progression of openings and how to gain the best position since my book collection is rather limited. I never use any help during a game. I agree with the previous poster. Unless you know where you were going with the moves the database won't help you. So I don't think there is a problem using them during a game and I think that many beginners and inexperienced players will benefit by using them to learn but I would have to fall into the category of a non-user myself.
As of 10/3/08:
Users - 82, Non-Users -99
opening explorer is a database.
Evil_Homer I apologize for my lack of clarity and the apparent contradiction. I know opening explorer is a database and I admit to using it but only as a study tool (ie: when I'm at work when I should be doing something other than thinking about chess). As I said my book collection right now is limited and I can play out the moves to understand the benefits and perils of each move using opening explorer. This forum, to my understanding, was whether we used the databases while playing turn-based chess. To that my answer is no. I probably should have just said that instead of also stating that I use them as a study tool.
briden wrote:
Non-user. I come to play chess with my brain, not lookup what someone else did and mimic it.
i think opening books, databases, etc. are a useful learning tool, but when used in game, cheapen the sport.
Before posting this, did you read post 776 by a NM who described why this attitude is flawed? Do you think he's wrong? If so, explain why you are correct and he is not.
Do you think the world correspondence chess championship cheapens the game?
I think what most cheapens the game is people who don't understand or respect the history and breadth of chess. What was the 1824 correspondence match between Edinburgh and London, a bunch of cheaters?
Oct 4, 2008
0
#726
I'm a moderate user myself. I don't have any fancy databases other than what's available here, nor do I deliberately steer games towards lines where I'm going to be at a theoretical advantage.
But part of the reason I play correspondence chess at all is to learn and practice, especially wrt unfamiliar lines and openings. If someone springs the Latvian Gambit or Ponziani's Opening or some other unusual line on me... well, what better way to learn, than to study up a bit, and then immediately put that knowledge into practice in my game?
no because you play people who uses different moves than your data base.that is other than unique traps and whatnot with those what i have written down i use.
Spiffe wrote:
I'm a moderate user myself. I don't have any fancy databases other than what's available here, nor do I deliberately steer games towards lines where I'm going to be at a theoretical advantage.
But part of the reason I play correspondence chess at all is to learn and practice, especially wrt unfamiliar lines and openings. If someone springs the Latvian Gambit or Ponziani's Opening or some other unusual line on me... well, what better way to learn, than to study up a bit, and then immediately put that knowledge into practice in my game?
As of 10/5/08:
Users - 84, Non-Users -100
cosmo6 wrote:
no because you play people who uses different moves than your data base.that is other than unique traps and whatnot with those what i have written down i use.
As of 10/5/08:
Users - 84, Non-Users -101
not during my games, sometimes after a game i look at a database to see what i could have done or should have done so whatever you would like to call it.
Red_Sox_Legend wrote:
not during my games, sometimes after a game i look at a database to see what i could have done or should have done so whatever you would like to call it.
As of 10/5/08:
Users - 84, Non-Users -102
MainStreet wrote:
Red_Sox_Legend wrote:
not during my games, sometimes after a game i look at a database to see what i could have done or should have done so whatever you would like to call it.
As of 10/5/08:
Users - 84, Non-Users -102
Y on EARTH are you ppl gettin up at 5:30 - 6:00 in the mornin?!?!
CheckmateBlack wrote:
MainStreet wrote:
Red_Sox_Legend wrote:
not during my games, sometimes after a game i look at a database to see what i could have done or should have done so whatever you would like to call it.
As of 10/5/08:
Users - 84, Non-Users -102
Y on EARTH are you ppl gettin up at 5:30 - 6:00 in the mornin?!?!
"Early to bed, early to rise, makes man healthy, wealthy and wise." - Benjamin Franklin :))
Diana_L wrote:
Perhaps I am missing something...but what is the connection between people getting up early and being user or non user?
I don't think there was supposed to be a connection. Just a joke about being up at 5:30 in the morning.
I use the analysis board extensively to try out various attacks. I don't use a chess database. I don't have any. Is that legal in Chess.com? I do read a lot of chess books.
Oct 7, 2008
0
#736
The distinction between User and Non-User is on the basis of these COT guidelines:
NON-USERS "... play "over the board" chess, as if we were playing face to face, and unable to use analysis boards, opening books, or any other external aid to help us, we promised we would use our knowledge and experience only to play the game." ( http://circleoftrust.bravehost.com/ )
USERS use any or all legitimate facilities while playing the game. This EXCLUDES Chess Engines (such as Fritz) and Endgame Tablebases. (chess.com playing rules)
Counted up to (and including) post #812.
Oct 7, 2008
0
#737
laser43 wrote:I use the analysis board extensively to try out various attacks. I don't use a chess database. I don't have any. Is that legal in Chess.com? I do read a lot of chess books.
If you click on Help at the top right of the screen, and click on What are the rules for playing? you will note it says (among other things) : You MAY use books, magazines, or other articles. You may also use computer databases (including Chess.com's Game Explorer).
What it does not make EXPLICIT at that point is that these facilities are ALLOWED DURING TURN-BASED CHESS but not during LiveChess.
Oct 7, 2008
0
#738
I think trhe FAQ entry I linked to earlier says something about Live Chess and Turn Based Chess. Not absolutely sure and I can't be bothered to go back and find it. I know I have seen it somewhere.
Per Artfizz's Standings,
As of 10/7/08:
Users - 84, Non-Users -100
(Thanks, Art.)
Oct 7, 2008
0
#740
This is one of the clearest descriptions of the site rules. http://www.chess.com/legal.html It's actually quite difficult to track down.
No Cheating or Computer Help
You can NEVER use chess programs (Chessmaster, Fritz, etc) to analyze current ongoing games unless specifically permitted (such as a computer tournament, etc). The only type of computer assistance allowed is games databases for opening lines in Turn-based Chess and Vote Chess. You cannot receive ANY outside assistance on Live Chess games.
SOME TIMES, BUT ONLY ONCE OR TWICE...
PROBABLY A USER...
As of 10/4/08:
Users - 83, Non-Users -100